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Robert Pally:
February, 2001
The
Sun Rises Here
The New Yorker Sun PK has many talents. Besides being an artist, painting,
doing drag shows and writing poetry, he just released a wonderful piece
of sixties sunshine pop à la Archies, Sagittarius and others. On Fufkin.com,
he tells everything about his world.
You do Music, Art, Philosophy and Drag. What do you enjoy most and
why?
Music. With music I feel I create something from my heart that I can share
and also enjoy without having to give away or sell a piece of my soul.
With my paintings I feel like even though I still retain the image by
way of a photograph when one is sold, I may never see the original piece
again. A piece of my soul is gone. With recorded music I've always got
the original and anyone who wants an original can have one too. Does that
make sense? A lot of the songs are filled with philosophy too.
Tell me a bit how you connect some of them with each other.
I hate to sound too 'high concept' but they connect out of my commitment
to creative self-expression.
Your
first full-length album "Inquire Within" is a very beautiful piece of
sixties sunshine pop. What are your influences and how have they actually
had an impact on the album?
I chose to do the album to evoke 60's pop because though I have eclectic
tastes the kind of music that makes my mouth water and heart melt most
is the music of that era. The bulk of my extensive 45 collection is from
that era. But I knew we (my Producer Daniel Wise & I) couldn't make it
sound really like the 60's simply because to attempt the constraints of
60's technology would be more costly than using current methods. I provided
Dan with almost 5 hours of tapes of songs and groups I wanted to emulate
or evoke. The first song on those tapes was Harper's Bizarre's version
of "Pocketful Of Miracles" and the last song was "And Then He Kissed Me"
by The Crystals. We did manage to get a laud to Phil Spector in there
in the oddest place! (Aside to Keith Cook, Yellow Balloon, New Colony
Six and Sagittarius songs were on those tapes - thank you for noticing
their inspirational presence!) Each song on "Inquire Within" had it's
own group of songs that we used for inspiration and motivation. Some of
the songs had lots of source material and they seem to sound the most
retro. Some songs we really zeroed in on one or two inspiration songs.
When we were doing "It's a Smiley Face World" Dan just kept going back,
much to my chagrin, to The Innocence version of "Mairzy Doats"! Certain
songs had little or no reference and we let them sort of create themselves
within the confines of the instruments we used as our palette. They wound
up sounding more contemporary. I had no source material for "Feel" (I
was clueless) and only 2 songs each for "On & On Forever" & "If Love Has
Ever Passed Me By" which we pretty much discarded. When we were working
on it we were really taken with the latter's evocativeness of Julee Cruise!
There were a few songs from the 80's, 90's and earlier 60's but most of
it was from like 1964-1970. I was coming from the point of view that I
might only have the opportunity to make one album ever so though we used
alot of the same instruments on many of the songs the styles vary. I told
Dan about The Turtles' album "The Battle Of The Bands" on which they played
each song as though they were a different band and that was roughly the
approach I wanted to take. Musically I wanted the album to make left turn
after left turn to keep the listener's interest. I start with an intriguing
little lullaby that hops into the ultra goofy, uplifting and fun (and,
philosophical) "It's a Smiley Face World". Then left turn into two very
pop-rock songs dripping with layers of acoustic and electric guitars then
left turn again into "The Puppet Master" which has no guitars at all but
features it's own many intriguing left turns within the song. Bill Dobrow,
the drummer called the song 'ear candy' the first time he heard it after
we finished it. And on it went and still goes. With the exception of a
few synth pads almost all of the other instruments we used were vintage.
Among the seven different guitars Mark Bosch played were a Melody Maker
and a '57 Gretsh. Dan played real Wurlitzer and Hammond Organs and so
on. Lyrically, too the album tells a story that takes left turn after
left turn. That story is there for anyone who cares to hear it. I'm actually
surprised that so many people get it. Kind of proves that bubblegum can
have a soul. But if the story eludes you, you still get what David Bash
calls "A pleasurable listen…a lovely album". I'm not being brief enough.
What
was the concept behind the CD cover? What did you want to express with
it?
I wanted to be brief and then you ask questions like this! There may be
many ways to hear "Inquire Within". Everyone hears differently. And many
ways to see the cover. There's a sign in the window that says 'Positions
Available, Inquire Within, No Experience Necessary'. Does that need an
explanation? There are three images of me. How do they look? Where are
they looking? Are they turning out or in? Which is smiling? Where is it
drab? Where are the colors? Heh, heh, heh. The back cover is a black &
white drawing I did with a lot of falderal written by a faux publicist
and a faux review by a faux critic for a faux magazine (a lot of faux
blaux as I call it) to emulate the back of a 60's album cover when they
did only the front in color to curb expenses and usually had a cheesy
black & white graphic with some ridiculous promo written by an 'industry
insider' or like Dick Clark or Jonathan King or somebody or other on the
back. I know it's a stretch. The title of the album is a lyric from the
song "I Wonder How I Know". A lot of the songs on the album are engaged
in (among other things) inquiry and wonder. Even the love songs…even the
sad songs. One friend said the inside of the j-card was a much more compelling
visual and would make a more eye-catching front cover but one must inquire
within to get to "Lavender Lane". There's more but I dare not go on!!!
In the lyrics you sing a lot about love. What is love for you?
Okay,
now you're hitting below the belt. No, I'll answer briefly, if possible.
Self love, intimate love, brotherly love, universal love. Really what
love is for me is answered quite thoroughly on the album and in the end
for all it's trials and tribulations "love will take you higher than you've
ever been before....
You
used to work as a Drag Queen. When and why did you pursue that career?
I needed a job! No, really! I'd been away for a while and when I came
back that was the first job I got. If you want more details I'll give
them to you but I'm trying to be brief. I haven't had a drag job in over
a year. I haven't had a regular drag job since like 1996.
Tell me more.
When I was a kid my mom would really get into dressing me up for Halloween.
I was either a clown or a woman...usually some 'grand dame' character.
It explains a lot. I talk about it in my memoirs. I hope to have some
excerpts from that on my site soon. As a young adult I was still into
Halloween and I would do drag or glam or androgynous stuff. Then every
so often somebody would need somebody in drag for some event or something.
I remember when I used to hang out at Club 57 it was a very 'performance
art-y' kind of club with a really mixed crowd and like one night we did
"Beauty Shop Night". We had wigs on wig forms on the bar with brushes
and hair spray for people to make hair-do's. There was a live demonstration
of dog grooming and I was asked to do the door that night so I did it
in this sort of maniacal manicurist drag. When they groomed the dog I
was asked to come up and do his nails. So I painted the dog's claws red!
One night we did a fake PTA (Parent Teacher Association) meeting. The
audience was the parents and the regular crew played like the Vice Principal
who showed educational films and the Librarian, a bull-dyke who was all
for burning the smutty books in the school library and a school nurse
who was a junkie. I played the special guest speaker, Dr Ruth Worsthomo
(A spoof of Dr. Ruth) who gave a frank lecture about sexuality in youngsters
and hormones and masturbation ...not to mention the importance of prophylactics
...imagine all that with as good a German accent as I could muster up.
Stuff like that. Then right before I went away one year it was Halloween
and I did black girl drag for the first time, LaToilette Jackson...there's
a thumbnail of her on my site in the drag section in The Pyramid Years
with a whole gallery coming up. Well after that it was like a dam broke.
I came back from being away and needed a job and that was the first one
I got. A friend who'd done the door at a club I'd tended bar at was managing
the Pyramid and he gave me a job....go-go dancing on the bar in over the
top and conceptual drag and I got to participate in some group shows and
do my own shows. That's really what made me begin to look at songwriting
seriously. I'd written and performed a couple of country songs in male
cowboy drag for a Grand Old Opry spoof at Club 57 a few years earlier
and then at the Pyramid I started writing my own songs for my own drag
shows. It was fun and creative and I was the only one who was doing that.
That's when I began to take songwriting workshops. My day job was selling
fabric and at the time I lived over a closeout fabric store. So you see
it all really ties together. I'm just a walking multi-media show! With
a philosophical streak! Is that enough detail for you? By the time we
finish with this interview it will be my entire memoir!
Were you a bit torn between being a man and dressing as a woman?
Gender, gender, gender...people make such a fuss! And as you can tell
by looking at my drag it's more about creative self-expression than sex.
Not only that, and here's where philosophy enters the picture. I hope
you're prepared. For me, physical gender exists as a mere convenience
for God. Just think, if God had not created gender, he or she...you see
how backward our planet is? The only way in which you can ascribe a what
is it 'pronoun' to God is to say him or her...or it and it seems so disrespectful.
Anyway, if God hadn't made this gender thing, he/she/it/God/The Great
Cosmic Schmutz/Our Lady Of The Immaculate Smiley Face (© 2000) would have
to keep creating us over and over again! Do our souls have physical gender?
How is gender defined in the spiritual domain? On the outside in this
physical domain we are male and female. Inside we are a spectrum of archetypes,
male, female, androgen and everything in between. Some are more masculine,
some are more feminine. Some may be completely masculine and some completely
feminine…who knows? And these ideas of masculinity and feminity …how are
they determined? Who created these ideas? Even on the Tarot, some of the
Deities are androgynous or hermaphrodite. That is a term that comes by
way of the child of Hermes and Aphrodite. The child was born with both
physical genders. This phenomenon still occurs - albeit rarely - but it
happens. Is this human manifestation of both genders accorded the glorification
one would expect when one is born with both sides of God's coin? No, it
is a freak. Perhaps somewhat like the gay population, which though not
born with both physical genders is born with archetypal genders generally
associated with the opposite sex. Needless to say, not all cross dressers
are gay! Of course it's okay for women to dress like men and not be considered
freaks. Indeed, particularly in the business world, when women masculinize
themselves and wear suits they are more likely to get ahead than the girls
who wear mini-skirts, spaghetti strap tops, sexy shoes and too much make-up.
That's because our planet has been dominated by men for myriad centuries.
It still is. So when men feminize themselves...or are simply feminine
just by the nature of who they are on the inside...being true to those
archetypes that exist in them and not being pressured into oppressing
them by the ethics of the world at large what is thought of them? A woman
may wear a business suit to the office with nary an eyebrow raised but
what if a man wore even what would be considered suitable women's attire
to the office. The eyebrows would be in the ozone. Derision and dismissal
would follow. This is a glimpse into the misogyny on the planet...the
devaluation of the feminine. People think we're out of the Dark Ages.
Not until the last hand is raised in violence against a fellow human (let
alone gun), not until all children are fed, nurtured, loved, treasured,
not until the people on this planet as one race become responsible for
this, the Garden of Eden - our home, not until "the axis of greed, that
makes the world spin" is done away with will we be out of the Dark Ages.
The biggest Dark Age atrocities in history occurred in the century we've
just left...and not just 6 million Jews were murdered in that war. 55
million human beings were killed in World War 2, let alone the 10 million
Stalin exterminated in his power struggle. 50 to 60 years is just a drop
in the bucket when you look at the universal picture. One lifetime but
a mere blink of an eye. Genocide is still being committed around the world.
And people are so uptight about sexual identity. I feel like I'm standing
on some sort of gay soapbox and really being gay isn't that important
to me. My music and art…they are important to me. I just happen to be
queer. Aren't there more important things than gender specificity and
sexual identity? Well, you asked for it! I could go on but that's another
discussion! When I catch somebody's ear, I always feel like I overstay
my welcome.
A
lot of people think that Drag Queens are only good for a laugh. I tend
more to think that they represent something sad and tragic. What is your
opinion about it?
Good for a laugh? Yes. Be funny …cover the pain. Most comedians have the
same gene. Probably most people in entertainment have the affliction.
There is a tragic side to drag...you are right. It's sad & tragic when
people have to feel bad about who they are because the world doesn't understand.
That doesn't just go for Drag Queens. It really goes for anyone who feels
in some way that they can't be true to himself or herself because of what
others think or some 'established accepted opinion' or idea about how
people should behave. Somehow Queens have that part licked. They just
go ahead and say, "Excuse me world, this is who I am and if you've got
a problem with it well, guess who's problem it is?" That's how the gay
movement began. With Queens saying that…and saying "I've got a right to
be a girl who has a penis if I want to and who are you to say I can't…Witch-Hunters?…The
Gender Police? Who put you in a position reserved for God alone?" But
I think some of the sadness is because of as you say, the 'outsider-ness'
of its nature. Also, there is a lot of pain and confusion ...most of which
I think comes from a rather belligerent, ignorant and phobic mainstream
world. That's why I try to make light of and shed light on the gender
thing. When feminine boys and masculine girls are growing up there is
little room for acceptance of this kind of behavior. When that child is
heterosexual the behavior seems to be overlooked because the relationships
they're engaging in are "normal". When those children are gay...well.
Do I need to spell it out? Maybe the sad and tragic part of it is really
the limitations people allow restrictive and unimaginative belief systems
to have on them. Geez, for all the religion in the world you'd think people
would be even the remotest bit spiritual…connected in some way with the
forgiving, understanding and accepting Cosmic Schmutz. I could go into
the aspects of drag that get interpreted through the "perversity filter"
many people walk around with on auto-pilot… I'm not denying that all sorts
of fetish ideas go with the turf…that happens the second you start fooling
with gender because people instantly sexualize anything to do with it
but hey, you don't have to be a Nellie Faggot Drag Queen to be a pervert.
Just look at my site. Honey, I'm a 'G' rated fag. 99% of the world
probably doesn't think such a thing could exist. That's perverse!
I'm embarrassed that I used the 'f' word in "Bear Witness" but if one
were ever to use that word in a song it ought to be in one called "Bear
Witness"!
Tell me how you got the name Sun PK?
I really had 2 separate drag careers. The first one was all about creating
characters. I could never come up with a single drag name. I just kept
creating all these characters. There are thumbnails of the main ones on
my site and soon I hope to have the whole cast of them in there. Then
I went into a 2-year semi-retirement after my mom died. Then I was asked
to be a Roxy Queen and the persona of Sun evolved. But not just as a drag
persona. Sun became a sort of stand to take. I wrote a song about it ...hopefully
I'll get to record it. It's called "Bright & Alive & Totally Uncool".
It's a stand for that it's okay to be soft in a world that's obsessed
with toughness...that it's okay to be happy and comfortable about being
a dweeb in a world that's obsessed with coolness at any cost. (That's
why Archie & Steve Urkel have been heroes of mine) It's okay to be bright
& colorful in a world that exhalts the darkness. "That's why it's gotta
be a smiley face world & on & on forever". But I digress...again & again…
my music publishing company is called Son of Boris after my father. I
had been asked to hostess a night at a club and I gave the promoter my
card. He said he'd call to ask what name I wanted on the invitation and
before I knew it there was my name 'Son of Boris' on the invite! A lot
of us thought it was really cool then one day a friend who was like our
Queen Mother was introducing me as Son of Boris and said, "Oh, I hate
introducing you like that" so I said, "just call me Son, I've been thinking
of shortening it to that anyway" and we all loved it. I changed it to
Sun because I was really into lots of day-glo colors and black lights
sort of like Psychedelic Power Barbie or Day-glo Minnie Mouse Barbie!
LOL. My drag was rarely about sex, even if it was sometimes ...or often
sexy, it was more just a great big outlet for creative self-expression.
I got to be Super Colorful and design and wear Fantastic and Ridiculous
clothes and jewelry...not to mention the shoes!...not even many real girls
take advantage of that they're women to do that! It was also really good
exercise! Then more people started calling me Sun in and out of drag so
I changed it legally. PK is the initials of my old name who is the person
Sun evolved from. Like "Move on, can't go back, and though you won't forget..."
Tell
me about your musical background.
I studied lots of instruments when I was a kid (piano, trumpet, clarinet,
violin & flute) but excelled at none. I started writing lyrics in earnest
as a teenager. I took a lot of songwriting workshops for like 7 years
in the 80's & early 90's. I'm going to give myself an honorary degree.
LSNOL. I talk about some of that on the trivia pages in the "Inquire Within"
section of my website. I had four great teachers but one, Henry Gaffney
made a huge impact on me with regard to melody. I'd always been melodic
but never understood that I could write melodically. That's actually what
I was doing but when Henry talked about actually crafting melodies sometimes
note by note it was like I could do it consciously and bring something
more to the process and without needing to play an instrument proficiently.
There's not a lot of agreement for that but I persisted and you are familiar
with the results. A friend of mine, John Link has a degree in music and
played "Inquire Within" for a friend of his who is a professor at Julliard
who declared me a genius! So much for music education!
You
also write Jingles. Can you tell me more about that? For whom have you
done Jingles so far?
All
the jingles I've done are on my site. (Nick at Nite, TV Land, Rug Rats
and Disney.) Except for a couple of TV Land jingles that were never used
and I turned into songs for my next album...if I get to record it!!! I
love writing jingles, it's usually a lot of fun and I enjoy the challenge
but it's as big a hustle to get the work as it is to network my beautiful
"Inquire Within" to finding its audience. The rewards of finding an audience
who will appreciate "Inquire Within" I'm sure will prove to be far more
rewarding than doing another exemplary job for television people with
a lot of tele and no vision!
You also paint. What inspires you your painting, for example, "Rainbow
Furl" or "The Living Hand"?
My imagination.
Tell me more.
I don't know if there are more details. I just do sketches...from awful
to good...and I begin a new painting by going through those sketches and
picking one that I like. Sometimes, but rarely, I come up with a color
scheme before I start painting. I did that with 'Rainbow Furl'. But usually
I just sit down...and I always start with the background...and say something
like, "Okay, hmm let's see, okay, BLUE!" It's really fun to watch them
evolve. My last roommate before I had to move watched 'Rainbow Furl' come
into being and he marveled at the process. He said something like "I never
would have known that it would turn out like this when it started." I
gave my producer, the genius Dan Wise a painting when "Inquire Within"
was complete and he marveled over my ability to create visually. He almost
seemed to feel kind of what?...incomplete? because he couldn't create
that way and I said to him, "I wouldn't worry about it honey, you paint
with sound!" Everybody has their God given gifts...like obviously, one
of your gifts is your ability to have people feel comfortable and open
up! You ask really good questions.
Sun Inquire Within
Internet: www.SunPK.com
Beautiful
Cover Inset of Sun Inquire Within by Sun
______________________________________________
Robert
Pally: The Splitsville Interview
Robert
Pally: The Margo Guryan Interview
E-mail
Robert
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